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Hello all,
There are several hundred desktop PCs install MS Hotfixes through WSUS 3.0,
but most users complain that they can not click "Restart Later" option , or
they don't want to restart their computers. Is there any way to force clients
install Hotfixes but don't give users any notification , that means, install
updates in complete silent.
Anybody can help me ? Thank you.
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On Jun 8, 9:28 am, Johnson <John...[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
[Quoted Text] > Hello all,
>
> There are several hundred desktop PCs install MS Hotfixes through WSUS 3.0,
> but most users complain that they can not click "Restart Later" option , or
> they don't want to restart their computers. Is there any way to force clients
> install Hotfixes but don't give users any notification , that means, install
> updates in complete silent.
>
> Anybody can help me ? Thank you.
If you set "Remove all access to Windows Update features" in the User
configuration of the Windows Update section in the (local computer/
domain) policy your users will have access to the Restart Later
button. But .... I dont think you would want to have that said to
anything else then disabled to prevent users updating their own
computer or even access Windows Update / Microsoft Update.
I do not believe theres an option to disable all popups and making all
update installs completely silent.
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In Group Policy enable Allow non-administrators to recieve update
notifications to allow them to click the Restart Later button.. Updates
cannot be installed completely silent - if one requires a reboot, you must
reboot. Do not install updates unless you can reboot the pc. I see many pc's
behave strange when updates are installed and the pc is not rebooted.
"Johnson" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > Hello all,
>
> There are several hundred desktop PCs install MS Hotfixes through WSUS 3.0,
> but most users complain that they can not click "Restart Later" option , or
> they don't want to restart their computers. Is there any way to force clients
> install Hotfixes but don't give users any notification , that means, install
> updates in complete silent.
>
> Anybody can help me ? Thank you.
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Thank you for your reply.
I also study GPO settings of WSUS long time, it seems hard to install
updates in silence. However, I found a way which maybe can instead of "in
silence": set AU "3-Auto download and notify for install", and disable "Allow
non-administrators to receive update notifications" , so that updates can be
downloaded and will be installed when users shutdown Windows. Still have a
question, how to force users install those downloaded updates when Windows is
shuting down ? Where is the default location after download them ? Is it
possible to install them through shutdown / logoff scripts ?
I will try to implement this "silent" way through shutdown scripts, I hope
can get supports from this discussion group. Thank you.
"redfoxert" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > On Jun 8, 9:28 am, Johnson <John...[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >
> > There are several hundred desktop PCs install MS Hotfixes through WSUS 3.0,
> > but most users complain that they can not click "Restart Later" option , or
> > they don't want to restart their computers. Is there any way to force clients
> > install Hotfixes but don't give users any notification , that means, install
> > updates in complete silent.
> >
> > Anybody can help me ? Thank you.
>
> If you set "Remove all access to Windows Update features" in the User
> configuration of the Windows Update section in the (local computer/
> domain) policy your users will have access to the Restart Later
> button. But .... I dont think you would want to have that said to
> anything else then disabled to prevent users updating their own
> computer or even access Windows Update / Microsoft Update.
>
> I do not believe theres an option to disable all popups and making all
> update installs completely silent.
>
>
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Yes, Windows must be rebooted after install updates. I have another proposal
regarding this issue, please refer to above reply.
Thank you for your reply.
"BigEd" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > In Group Policy enable Allow non-administrators to recieve update
> notifications to allow them to click the Restart Later button.. Updates
> cannot be installed completely silent - if one requires a reboot, you must
> reboot. Do not install updates unless you can reboot the pc. I see many pc's
> behave strange when updates are installed and the pc is not rebooted.
>
> "Johnson" wrote:
>
> > Hello all,
> >
> > There are several hundred desktop PCs install MS Hotfixes through WSUS 3.0,
> > but most users complain that they can not click "Restart Later" option , or
> > they don't want to restart their computers. Is there any way to force clients
> > install Hotfixes but don't give users any notification , that means, install
> > updates in complete silent.
> >
> > Anybody can help me ? Thank you.
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Johnson wrote:
[Quoted Text] > I also study GPO settings of WSUS long time, it seems hard to install
> updates in silence. However, I found a way which maybe can instead of "in
> silence": set AU "3-Auto download and notify for install", and disable "Allow
> non-administrators to receive update notifications" , so that updates can be
> downloaded and will be installed when users shutdown Windows. Still have a
> question, how to force users install those downloaded updates when Windows is
> shuting down ? Where is the default location after download them ? Is it
> possible to install them through shutdown / logoff scripts ?
The Windows Update Agent provides an API that should allow you to write a
program to do this.
<http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa387099.aspx>
However, you need to ask yourself a few questions before going this way:
1) Can I be sure that users will shut down their computers regularly?
2) Will users ever need to reboot their computers without the delay installing
patches will introduce?
There may also be an issue if the shutdown script times out, might this leave
the system in an unstable state? (I would guess that it wouldn't, except that
only some of the patches would be installed - but this should be tested.)
Harry.
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"Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:D2D67711-84B2-4ADB-9501-E30C79B19EE2[ at ]microsoft.com...
[Quoted Text] > I also study GPO settings of WSUS long time, it seems hard to install
> updates in silence. However, I found a way which maybe can instead of "in
> silence": set AU "3-Auto download and notify for install", and disable
> "Allow
> non-administrators to receive update notifications" , so that updates can
> be
> downloaded and will be installed when users shutdown Windows.
Take note that this can only be done on Windows XP SP2 (or later) systems,
and it requires the cooperation of your users.
> Still have a
> question, how to force users install those downloaded updates when Windows
> is
> shuting down ?
The "Install Updates and Shutdown" option is presented as an *option* to
your users. They can easily override it by selecting the "Shutdown" or
"Restart" option from the dialog box. There is no way to force compliance
with this option.
The *BEST* was to "install updates in silence" is to:
[a] require users to leave their PCs powered on when updates are
scheduled to install, but LOG OFF.
[b] Schedule updates to install during NON-working hours, and allow the
system to restart immediately after the installation.
Which, btw, is the default configuration of WSUS!
> Where is the default location after download them ? Is it
> possible to install them through shutdown / logoff scripts ?
All update content is downloaded to %windir%\softwaredistribution\download
It *is* possible to install updates through a script. You'll want to refer
to the WUA API/SDK for detailed information.
Note: Installing updates via a script still will not remove the
*REQUIREMENT* to reboot a system if that's part of the steps necessary to
complete an update installation.
--
Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP
Independent WSUS Evangelist
MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007)
https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095EB07B36E
Everything you need for WSUS is at
http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/wsus/default.mspx
And, almost everything else is at
http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com
.....
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Thank you for your support.
In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do not have a
good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on NON-working
hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after install updates. I know
it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, actually we
can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT professionals. I think
the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy to force
Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers.
Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is a useful
feature.
Thank you.
"Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:D2D67711-84B2-4ADB-9501-E30C79B19EE2[ at ]microsoft.com... > > > I also study GPO settings of WSUS long time, it seems hard to install > > updates in silence. However, I found a way which maybe can instead of "in > > silence": set AU "3-Auto download and notify for install", and disable > > "Allow > > non-administrators to receive update notifications" , so that updates can > > be > > downloaded and will be installed when users shutdown Windows. > > Take note that this can only be done on Windows XP SP2 (or later) systems, > and it requires the cooperation of your users. > > > Still have a > > question, how to force users install those downloaded updates when Windows > > is > > shuting down ? > > The "Install Updates and Shutdown" option is presented as an *option* to > your users. They can easily override it by selecting the "Shutdown" or > "Restart" option from the dialog box. There is no way to force compliance > with this option. > > The *BEST* was to "install updates in silence" is to: > [a] require users to leave their PCs powered on when updates are > scheduled to install, but LOG OFF. > [b] Schedule updates to install during NON-working hours, and allow the > system to restart immediately after the installation. > > Which, btw, is the default configuration of WSUS! > > > Where is the default location after download them ? Is it > > possible to install them through shutdown / logoff scripts ? > > All update content is downloaded to %windir%\softwaredistribution\download > > It *is* possible to install updates through a script. You'll want to refer > to the WUA API/SDK for detailed information. > > Note: Installing updates via a script still will not remove the > *REQUIREMENT* to reboot a system if that's part of the steps necessary to > complete an update installation. > > -- > Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP > Independent WSUS Evangelist > MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) > https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095EB07B36E> > Everything you need for WSUS is at > http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/wsus/default.mspx> > And, almost everything else is at > http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com> ..... > > > > |
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Thank you. I will try and I hope the Windows Update Agent API can work well.
"Harry Johnston" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > Johnson wrote: > > > I also study GPO settings of WSUS long time, it seems hard to install > > updates in silence. However, I found a way which maybe can instead of "in > > silence": set AU "3-Auto download and notify for install", and disable "Allow > > non-administrators to receive update notifications" , so that updates can be > > downloaded and will be installed when users shutdown Windows. Still have a > > question, how to force users install those downloaded updates when Windows is > > shuting down ? Where is the default location after download them ? Is it > > possible to install them through shutdown / logoff scripts ? > > The Windows Update Agent provides an API that should allow you to write a > program to do this. > > < http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa387099.aspx>> > However, you need to ask yourself a few questions before going this way: > > 1) Can I be sure that users will shut down their computers regularly? > > 2) Will users ever need to reboot their computers without the delay installing > patches will introduce? > > There may also be an issue if the shutdown script times out, might this leave > the system in an unstable state? (I would guess that it wouldn't, except that > only some of the patches would be installed - but this should be tested.) > > Harry. > |
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"Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com...
[Quoted Text] >
> Thank you for your support.
>
> In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do not have
> a
> good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on NON-working
> hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after install updates. I
> know
> it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, actually
> we
> can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT professionals. I
> think
> the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy to
> force
> Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers.
Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at =3am=!
The machine will restart as needed.
Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer users...
while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this analogy:
Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the
intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner knows
these three things:
[a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start.
[b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow out.
[c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the engine will blow
up.
It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows
machines need updates, and those updates require the system to reboot.
Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these updates now
come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of every month.
Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of the use
of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, ideally on the
second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened organization who does a modicum
of testing before mass rollout, maybe not until the second or third
=Friday=, updates are a comin', and it requires two simple things:
[a] Don't power off the computer.
[b] Save your work and log off the computer.
Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for users who
[a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't remember to log off at
the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER PROBLEMS than worrying about getting
Windows updates applied to a desktop computer!
(Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>)
> Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is a
> useful
> feature.
I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added above.
And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the system
/forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown.
In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not familiar" as
you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing to do.
Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would occur
if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK on a forced
Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and popped the power switch
while those updates were being installed. Consider, for a small moment, how
much time you'd spend either [a] rebuilding user profiles in the best case,
or [b] reinstalling operating systems in the worst case.
Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users who are
not aware of the implications and the criticality of not flipping the power
switch.
If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I would say
DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature.
--
Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP
Independent WSUS Evangelist
MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007)
https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095EB07B36E
Everything you need for WSUS is at
http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/wsus/default.mspx
And, almost everything else is at
http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com
.....
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I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give admins that
option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] PCs should be
rebooted after install updates. If those updates are installed during shuting
down Windows, will minimize inconveniences for the users. Computers just are
a kind of tool, it is IT professionals' duty to make this tool more usable.
So I think MS should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you
can selet other way to deploy updates.
Thank you.
"Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... > > > > Thank you for your support. > > > > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do not have > > a > > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on NON-working > > hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after install updates. I > > know > > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, actually > > we > > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT professionals. I > > think > > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy to > > force > > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. > > Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at =3am=! > The machine will restart as needed. > > Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer users... > while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this analogy: > > Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the > intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner knows > these three things: > [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. > [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow out. > [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the engine will blow > up. > > It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows > machines need updates, and those updates require the system to reboot. > Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these updates now > come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of every month. > > Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of the use > of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, ideally on the > second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened organization who does a modicum > of testing before mass rollout, maybe not until the second or third > =Friday=, updates are a comin', and it requires two simple things: > [a] Don't power off the computer. > [b] Save your work and log off the computer. > > Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for users who > [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't remember to log off at > the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER PROBLEMS than worrying about getting > Windows updates applied to a desktop computer! > > (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) > > > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is a > > useful > > feature. > > I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added above. > > And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the system > /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. > > In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not familiar" as > you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing to do. > > Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would occur > if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK on a forced > Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and popped the power switch > while those updates were being installed. Consider, for a small moment, how > much time you'd spend either [a] rebuilding user profiles in the best case, > or [b] reinstalling operating systems in the worst case. > > Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users who are > not aware of the implications and the criticality of not flipping the power > switch. > > If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I would say > DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. > > > -- > Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP > Independent WSUS Evangelist > MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) > https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095EB07B36E> > Everything you need for WSUS is at > http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/wsus/default.mspx> > And, almost everything else is at > http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com> ..... > > > |
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I ended up solving the problem here by removing the 'shutdown' option via
GPO. Users can only logoff, and applying and rebooting at 3:00am. Users
are instructed to logoff, those who don't and leave unsaved work don't
get a sympathetic ear from me, or management, as they are in violation of
company policy.
With proper power settings, an idle computer does not use a whole lot
more power than if shut down.
=?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com:
[Quoted Text] > > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give admins > that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] PCs > should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can > selet other way to deploy updates. > > Thank you. > > > > > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: > >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... >> > >> > Thank you for your support. >> > >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do >> > not have a >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after >> > install updates. I know >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, >> > actually we >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT >> > professionals. I think >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy >> > to force >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. >> >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at >> =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. >> >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this >> analogy: >> >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the >> intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner >> knows these three things: >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow >> out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the >> engine will blow >> up. >> >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows >> machines need updates, and those updates require the system to >> reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these >> updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of >> every month. >> >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, maybe >> not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a comin', and it >> requires two simple things: >> [a] Don't power off the computer. >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. >> >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a >> desktop computer! >> >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) >> >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is >> > a useful >> > feature. >> >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added >> above. >> >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the >> system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. >> >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing >> to do. >> >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would >> occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK >> on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and >> popped the power switch while those updates were being installed. >> Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd spend either [a] >> rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] reinstalling >> operating systems in the worst case. >> >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users >> who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of not >> flipping the power switch. >> >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. >> >> >> -- >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP >> Independent WSUS Evangelist >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095>> EB07B36E >> >> Everything you need for WSUS is at >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/w>> sus/default.mspx >> >> And, almost everything else is at >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com>> ..... >> >> >> >
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I've seen users hard power down during offline folder sync because it
takes too long, what do you think they'll do during an hour's worth of
updates????
=?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com:
[Quoted Text] > > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give admins > that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] PCs > should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can > selet other way to deploy updates. > > Thank you. > > > > > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: > >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... >> > >> > Thank you for your support. >> > >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do >> > not have a >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after >> > install updates. I know >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, >> > actually we >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT >> > professionals. I think >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy >> > to force >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. >> >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at >> =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. >> >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this >> analogy: >> >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the >> intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner >> knows these three things: >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow >> out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the >> engine will blow >> up. >> >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows >> machines need updates, and those updates require the system to >> reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these >> updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of >> every month. >> >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, maybe >> not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a comin', and it >> requires two simple things: >> [a] Don't power off the computer. >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. >> >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a >> desktop computer! >> >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) >> >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is >> > a useful >> > feature. >> >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added >> above. >> >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the >> system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. >> >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing >> to do. >> >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would >> occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK >> on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and >> popped the power switch while those updates were being installed. >> Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd spend either [a] >> rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] reinstalling >> operating systems in the worst case. >> >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users >> who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of not >> flipping the power switch. >> >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. >> >> >> -- >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP >> Independent WSUS Evangelist >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095>> EB07B36E >> >> Everything you need for WSUS is at >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/w>> sus/default.mspx >> >> And, almost everything else is at >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com>> ..... >> >> >>
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I don't think it is a good solution that remove the "shutdown" option, [a] it
will waste more power,[b] Windows XP is a desktop OS , I think it should be
shutted down or rebooted after work some time.
"Asher_N" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > I ended up solving the problem here by removing the 'shutdown' option via > GPO. Users can only logoff, and applying and rebooting at 3:00am. Users > are instructed to logoff, those who don't and leave unsaved work don't > get a sympathetic ear from me, or management, as they are in violation of > company policy. > > With proper power settings, an idle computer does not use a whole lot > more power than if shut down. > > =?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in > news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com: > > > > > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give admins > > that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] PCs > > should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are > > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences > > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT > > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS > > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can > > selet other way to deploy updates. > > > > Thank you. > > > > > > > > > > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: > > > >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... > >> > > >> > Thank you for your support. > >> > > >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do > >> > not have a > >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on > >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after > >> > install updates. I know > >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, > >> > actually we > >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT > >> > professionals. I think > >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy > >> > to force > >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. > >> > >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at > >> =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. > >> > >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer > >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this > >> analogy: > >> > >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the > >> intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner > >> knows these three things: > >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. > >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow > >> out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the > >> engine will blow > >> up. > >> > >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows > >> machines need updates, and those updates require the system to > >> reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these > >> updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of > >> every month. > >> > >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of > >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, > >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened > >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, maybe > >> not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a comin', and it > >> requires two simple things: > >> [a] Don't power off the computer. > >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. > >> > >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for > >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't > >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER > >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a > >> desktop computer! > >> > >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) > >> > >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is > >> > a useful > >> > feature. > >> > >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added > >> above. > >> > >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the > >> system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. > >> > >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not > >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing > >> to do. > >> > >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would > >> occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK > >> on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and > >> popped the power switch while those updates were being installed. > >> Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd spend either [a] > >> rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] reinstalling > >> operating systems in the worst case. > >> > >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users > >> who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of not > >> flipping the power switch. > >> > >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I > >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP > >> Independent WSUS Evangelist > >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) > >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095> >> EB07B36E > >> > >> Everything you need for WSUS is at > >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/w> >> sus/default.mspx > >> > >> And, almost everything else is at > >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com> >> ..... > >> > >> > >> > > > > |
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In general , MS just release several updates for a certain platform, I don't
think installing these updates will take an hour.
"Asher_N" wrote:
[Quoted Text] > I've seen users hard power down during offline folder sync because it > takes too long, what do you think they'll do during an hour's worth of > updates???? > > =?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in > news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com: > > > > > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give admins > > that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] PCs > > should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are > > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences > > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT > > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS > > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can > > selet other way to deploy updates. > > > > Thank you. > > > > > > > > > > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: > > > >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message > >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... > >> > > >> > Thank you for your support. > >> > > >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them do > >> > not have a > >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on > >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after > >> > install updates. I know > >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, > >> > actually we > >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT > >> > professionals. I think > >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in policy > >> > to force > >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. > >> > >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates at > >> =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. > >> > >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer > >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this > >> analogy: > >> > >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or the > >> intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto owner > >> knows these three things: > >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. > >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll blow > >> out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, the > >> engine will blow > >> up. > >> > >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that Windows > >> machines need updates, and those updates require the system to > >> reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years ago that these > >> updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the second Tuesday of > >> every month. > >> > >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of > >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, > >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened > >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, maybe > >> not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a comin', and it > >> requires two simple things: > >> [a] Don't power off the computer. > >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. > >> > >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for > >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't > >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER > >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a > >> desktop computer! > >> > >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) > >> > >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this is > >> > a useful > >> > feature. > >> > >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments added > >> above. > >> > >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if the > >> system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. > >> > >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not > >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS thing > >> to do. > >> > >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that would > >> occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users clicked on OK > >> on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then reached over and > >> popped the power switch while those updates were being installed. > >> Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd spend either [a] > >> rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] reinstalling > >> operating systems in the worst case. > >> > >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to users > >> who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of not > >> flipping the power switch. > >> > >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I > >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP > >> Independent WSUS Evangelist > >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) > >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D095> >> EB07B36E > >> > >> Everything you need for WSUS is at > >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/featured/w> >> sus/default.mspx > >> > >> And, almost everything else is at > >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com> >> ..... > >> > >> > >> > > |
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Once a desktop goes into power saving mode (display and drives shutdown),
it uses almost no power. Remember that even a power off PC uses power,
unless you trip the switch on the power supply.
I have a large number of workstations that must be on 24/7. No issues.
Keep in mind that the update process will renoot the systems from time to
time.
=?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
news:2C8F311A-974A-4F31-A6EC-10DD35EEB54B[ at ]microsoft.com:
[Quoted Text] > I don't think it is a good solution that remove the "shutdown" option, > [a] it will waste more power,[b] Windows XP is a desktop OS , I think > it should be shutted down or rebooted after work some time. > > "Asher_N" wrote: > >> I ended up solving the problem here by removing the 'shutdown' option >> via GPO. Users can only logoff, and applying and rebooting at 3:00am. >> Users are instructed to logoff, those who don't and leave unsaved >> work don't get a sympathetic ear from me, or management, as they are >> in violation of company policy. >> >> With proper power settings, an idle computer does not use a whole lot >> more power than if shut down. >> >> =?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in >> news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com: >> >> > >> > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give >> > admins that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] >> > PCs should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are >> > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences >> > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT >> > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS >> > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can >> > selet other way to deploy updates. >> > >> > Thank you. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: >> > >> >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... >> >> > >> >> > Thank you for your support. >> >> > >> >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them >> >> > do not have a >> >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on >> >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after >> >> > install updates. I know >> >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, >> >> > actually we >> >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT >> >> > professionals. I think >> >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in >> >> > policy to force >> >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. >> >> >> >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates >> >> at =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. >> >> >> >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer >> >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this >> >> analogy: >> >> >> >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or >> >> the intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto >> >> owner knows these three things: >> >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. >> >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll >> >> blow out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, >> >> the engine will blow >> >> up. >> >> >> >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that >> >> Windows machines need updates, and those updates require the >> >> system to reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years >> >> ago that these updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the >> >> second Tuesday of every month. >> >> >> >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of >> >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, >> >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened >> >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, >> >> maybe not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a >> >> comin', and it requires two simple things: >> >> [a] Don't power off the computer. >> >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. >> >> >> >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for >> >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't >> >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER >> >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a >> >> desktop computer! >> >> >> >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) >> >> >> >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this >> >> > is a useful >> >> > feature. >> >> >> >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments >> >> added above. >> >> >> >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if >> >> the system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. >> >> >> >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not >> >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS >> >> thing to do. >> >> >> >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that >> >> would occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users >> >> clicked on OK on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then >> >> reached over and popped the power switch while those updates were >> >> being installed. Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd >> >> spend either [a] rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] >> >> reinstalling operating systems in the worst case. >> >> >> >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to >> >> users who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of >> >> not flipping the power switch. >> >> >> >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I >> >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP >> >> Independent WSUS Evangelist >> >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) >> >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D>> >> 095 EB07B36E >> >> >> >> Everything you need for WSUS is at >> >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/feature>> >> d/w sus/default.mspx >> >> >> >> And, almost everything else is at >> >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com>> >> ..... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >>
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Not unusual for a number of updfates to take a lot of time. By the time
testing is done, there may be a fair number of updates coming through.
..Net framework updates usually take a lot of time.
=?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
news:B0B907F5-7119-42C8-A53A-8607D5B00FDA[ at ]microsoft.com:
[Quoted Text] > In general , MS just release several updates for a certain platform, I > don't think installing these updates will take an hour. > > "Asher_N" wrote: > >> I've seen users hard power down during offline folder sync because it >> takes too long, what do you think they'll do during an hour's worth >> of updates???? >> >> =?Utf-8?B?Sm9obnNvbg==?= <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in >> news:DC818014-E2D6-4063-8A17-3FE2EB64C3EC[ at ]microsoft.com: >> >> > >> > I agree with what you said , but I still think MS should give >> > admins that option. The factor is, [a] PCs must install updates;[b] >> > PCs should be rebooted after install updates. If those updates are >> > installed during shuting down Windows, will minimize inconveniences >> > for the users. Computers just are a kind of tool, it is IT >> > professionals' duty to make this tool more usable. So I think MS >> > should give us this option, it's just an option, ofcourse you can >> > selet other way to deploy updates. >> > >> > Thank you. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > "Lawrence Garvin (MVP)" wrote: >> > >> >> "Johnson" <Johnson[ at ]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message >> >> news:90CB2400-FC6E-4591-AFEC-4BC599DDE0CE[ at ]microsoft.com... >> >> > >> >> > Thank you for your support. >> >> > >> >> > In general, users are not familiar with computer, most of them >> >> > do not have a >> >> > good habit of saving their data before leave computers / be on >> >> > NON-working hours, so PCs can not be rebooted immediately after >> >> > install updates. I know >> >> > it is necessary to reboot PCs immediately after install updates, >> >> > actually we >> >> > can't . Microsoft should know, most people are NOT IT >> >> > professionals. I think >> >> > the best way to install updates is, give Admin an option in >> >> > policy to force >> >> > Windows to install them when shut down / reboot computers. >> >> >> >> Again, they do. It's the *default* configuration. Install updates >> >> at =3am=! The machine will restart as needed. >> >> >> >> Btw.. as for the argument concerning the skill set of computer >> >> users... while I'm sympathetic to a point, I'll also offer this >> >> analogy: >> >> >> >> Most autombile drivers are not familiar with auto mechanics, or >> >> the intracies of the internal combustion engine, but *every* auto >> >> owner knows these three things: >> >> [a] If you don't put gasoline in the car, it won't start. >> >> [b] If you don't maintain air pressure in the tires, they'll >> >> blow out. [c] If you don't maintain/change oil in the engine, >> >> the engine will blow >> >> up. >> >> >> >> It's a given fact, for long been more than 10 years now, that >> >> Windows machines need updates, and those updates require the >> >> system to reboot. Microsoft kindly created a system a few years >> >> ago that these updates now come on a *predictable* basis, on the >> >> second Tuesday of every month. >> >> >> >> Personally, I think it's ought to be considered a *requirement* of >> >> the use of a computer in one's job to accept that once a month, >> >> ideally on the second Tuesday, but maybe in an enlightened >> >> organization who does a modicum of testing before mass rollout, >> >> maybe not until the second or third =Friday=, updates are a >> >> comin', and it requires two simple things: >> >> [a] Don't power off the computer. >> >> [b] Save your work and log off the computer. >> >> >> >> Quite frankly, *ANY* organization who's still making excuses for >> >> users who [a] can't remember to save their work, or [b] can't >> >> remember to log off at the end of the workday has MUCH BIGGER >> >> PROBLEMS than worrying about getting Windows updates applied to a >> >> desktop computer! >> >> >> >> (Just in case you wondered what I *really* think. <g>) >> >> >> >> > Your are a MS MVP, can you forward my idea to MS ? I think this >> >> > is a useful >> >> > feature. >> >> >> >> I can... but they'd be heavily flavored with my other arguments >> >> added above. >> >> >> >> And, of course, there would be just as many people complaining if >> >> the system /forced/ somebody to install updates at shutdown. >> >> >> >> In fact, installing updates at shutdown, for a user who is "not >> >> familiar" as you describe above, is actually a VERY DANGEROUS >> >> thing to do. >> >> >> >> Consider, for a small moment, the catastrophic corruption that >> >> would occur if one of your not-so-technically-literate users >> >> clicked on OK on a forced Install-at-Shutdown event, and then >> >> reached over and popped the power switch while those updates were >> >> being installed. Consider, for a small moment, how much time you'd >> >> spend either [a] rebuilding user profiles in the best case, or [b] >> >> reinstalling operating systems in the worst case. >> >> >> >> Install at Shutdown is an operation not to be given lightly to >> >> users who are not aware of the implications and the criticality of >> >> not flipping the power switch. >> >> >> >> If you have users who routinely power off their systems.... then I >> >> would say DO NOT use the "Install Updates at Shutdown" feature. >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Lawrence Garvin, M.S., MCTS, MCP >> >> Independent WSUS Evangelist >> >> MVP-Software Distribution (2005-2007) >> >> https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile=30E00990-8F1D-4774-BD62-D>> >> 095 EB07B36E >> >> >> >> Everything you need for WSUS is at >> >> http://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver/en/technologies/feature>> >> d/w sus/default.mspx >> >> >> >> And, almost everything else is at >> >> http://wsusinfo.onsitechsolutions.com>> >> ..... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>
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